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Common Ground Common Sense > Issues that Affect Our Lives > U.S. Military Issues > Active Military Issues
Indianhead
I heard that 40,000 pounds of bombs were delivered today in 10 minutes in Iraq
near Baghdad. Four 1,000-pounders per minute...that's heavy delivery. I hope results
are relatively effective. I wish we had had such an ability in '69-70. I walked thorugh
20-foot deep, 50-foot-wide 1,000# created holes. Shizen...it should deliver a major
improvement...will it?
amy
QUOTE(Indianhead @ Jan 10 2008, 07:16 PM) *
I heard that 40,000 pounds of bombs were delivered today in 10 minutes in Iraq
near Baghdad. Four 1,000-pounders per minute...that's heavy delivery. I hope results
are relatively effective. I wish we had had such an ability in '69-70. I walked thorugh
20-foot deep, 50-foot-wide 1,000# created holes. Shizen...it should deliver a major
improvement...will it?


Well, from what I've read, many of the intended targets of those mega bombs knew they were arriving, so they left the area.....wonder how many innocent civilians were killed or injured.....
Indianhead
Since we invaded? 151,000 civilians...but we can write those off as
collateral damage...I'm just glad my mother and sister haven't been
collateral damage.

Fact is, too few grunts...too much corporate high explosive...chickenhawk
tactics
...in an invasion without justification...but what do I know?

I'm not patriotic enough, according to neo-cons wanna-bes.
jeffmoskin
4 a minute.

Sounds like McDonalds.

How American.
lenal
And I suppose the fighters allied with AlQueda are blind and would notice the exodus? Another example of how dumb this war is being fought......what are they doing destroying more infrastructure to be rebuilt by Halliburton contracts before the rug is pulled out from under their mole in the Veep office?

Crazy,,,crazy.......

The whole area is revved up right when W appears over there,......looks like muscle flexing again......sad sad.

lenal
Indianhead
Strange thing is that if 200,000 troops had been produced by a mini-draft...
than 40,000 guys would have been more effective in rotation....which is the
way 5 shifts translates...but what do I know...I just don't respect air-power
which is vague and indiscriminate over troops which can make decisions
in person...on the ground...in the glory of risk and combat.

Bombs or boots...a grunt's perspective.
Marine


Meet Brian Chontosh
Churchville-Chili Central School
Class of 1991.






Proud graduate of the Rochester Institute of Technology.








Husband and about-to-be father. First lieutenant (now Captain) in the United States Marine Corps.

And a genuine hero, the secretary of the Navy said so yesterday.

At 29 Palms in California Brian Chontosh was presented with the Navy Cross, the second highest award for combat bravery the United States can bestow.




That's a big deal. But you won't see it on the network news tonight





And all you'll read in Brian's hometown newspaper is two paragraphs of nothing.

The odd fact about the American media in this war is that it's not covering the American military. The most plugged-in nation in the world is receiving virtually no true information about what its warriors are doing.






Oh, sure, there's a body count. We know how many Americans have fallen. And we see those same casket pictures day in and day out.






And we're almost on a first-name basis with the jerks who abused the Iraqi prisoners. And we know all about improvised explosive devices and how we lost Fallujah and what Arab public-opinion polls say about us and how the world hates us.






We get a non-stop feed of gloom and doom but we don't hear about the heroes.

The incredibly brave GIs who honorably do their duty. The ones our grandparents would have carried on their shoulders down Fifth Avenue.







The ones we completely ignore, ike Brian Chontosh.

It was a year ago on the march into Baghdad. Brian Chontosh was a platoon leader rolling up Highway 1 in a humvee.








When all hell broke loose.

Ambush city.

The young Marines were being cut to ribbons. Mortars, machine guns, rocket propelled grenades.






And the kid out of Churchville was in charge. It was do or die and it was up to him.


So he moved to the side of his column, looking for a way to lead his men to safety. As he tried to poke a hole through the Iraqi line his humvee came under direct enemy machine gun fire. It was fish in a barrel and the Marines were the fish. And Brian Chontosh gave the order to attack.








He told his driver to floor the humvee directly at the machine gun emplacement that was firing at them. And he had the guy on top with the 50 cal unload on them.












Within moments there were Iraqis slumped across the machine gun and Chontosh was still advancing, ordering his driver now to take the humvee directly into the Iraqi trench that was attacking his Marines.








Over into the battlement the humvee went and out the door Brian Chontosh bailed, carrying an M16



and a Beretta



and 228 years of Marine Corps pride.








And he ran along the trench, with its mortars and riflemen, machineguns and grenadiers. And he killed them all.

He fought with the M16 until it was out of ammo.

Then he fought with the Beretta until it was out of ammo. Then he picked up a dead man's AK4 and fought with that until it was out of ammo.



Then he picked up another dead man's AK47 and fought with that until it was out of ammo.



At one point he even fired a discarded Iraqi RPG into an enemy cluster, sending attackers flying with its grenade explosion.







When he was done Brian Chontosh had cleared 200 yards of entrenched Iraqis from his platoon's flank. He had killed more than 20 and wounded at least as many more.







But that's probably not how he would tell it. He would probably merely say that his Marines were in trouble, and he got them out of trouble. Ooh-rah, and drive on.







"By his outstanding display of decisive leadership, unlimited courage in the face of heavy enemy fire, and utmost devotion to duty, 1st Lt. Chontosh reflected great credit upon himself and upheld the highest traditions of the Marine Corps and the United States Naval Service."

That's what the citation says.
And that's what nobody will hear.
That's what doesn't seem to be making the evening news.



Accounts of American valor are dismissed by the press as propaganda, yet accounts of American difficulties are heralded as objectivity. It makes you wonder if the role of the media is to inform or to depress - to report or to deride. To tell the truth, or to feed us lies.



But I guess it doesn't matter. We're going to turn out all right As long as men like Brian Chontosh wear our uniform.


Indianhead
A Texas boot?

Is that a DSC or Navy Cross on his fatigues? Nice to wear in formation...
put away in action...but never put away in history. Hoo-Ha leatherneck.
Marine
QUOTE(Indianhead @ Jan 17 2008, 07:25 PM) *
A Texas boot?

Is that a DSC or Navy Cross on his fatigues? Nice to wear in formation...
put away in action...but never put away in history. Hoo-Ha leatherneck.

Navy Cross, in the proudest traditions of the United States Naval Services.
Indianhead
QUOTE(Marine @ Jan 19 2008, 03:11 PM) *
Navy Cross, in the proudest traditions of the United States Naval Services.


It's a beaut...and I should have read all the post...I'd have known.

I just get kinda tired of media flogging...now the markets are blaming
"a lack confidence" and "negitivists" for the market down turn.
I've read so much stuff about how we were winning the Vietnam
War and it was the media which was responsible for the loss.
I give those hardcore little yellow guys more credit. They died well.

But, back to the hardware. There always seems to be American men
who rise to the occassion they shoulder...surely, a proud tradition.
Marine
QUOTE(Indianhead @ Jan 19 2008, 04:39 PM) *
It's a beaut...and I should have read all the post...I'd have known.

I just get kinda tired of media flogging...now the markets are blaming
"a lack confidence" and "negitivists" for the market down turn.
I've read so much stuff about how we were winning the Vietnam
War and it was the media which was responsible for the loss.
I give those hardcore little yellow guys more credit. They died well.

But, back to the hardware. There always seems to be American men
who rise to the occassion they shoulder...surely, a proud tradition.

As far as the economy goes expectations is the prime driving force of the economy. My first college degree was in economics and I am indeed fortunate of having the professors who taught me. Most programs in economics teach the mathematical, analytical, number crunching form of economics only. I got a good smattering of that but what economics really is was drumed into me. Economics is a social science, it's why people buy and sell, it's more akin to anthropology than to calculus.

People's expectations are what drive the market. The media can indeed drive the market into recession through biased reporting. My belief is a few people control the large news outlets and those few people are in fact the people who have run this country for many years. The internet has challenged their hold on power.

Remember when the Monica Lewinsky scandal broke 10 years ago? Michael Isikoff had the scoop of the century and the editors of Time spiked his story. Had the internet not existed that would a been the end of it. Makes you wonder just how many stories have been spiked over the years, doesn't it?
Indianhead

Monica , as a sexual indiscretion story, appeared where it should have - Drudge...then out.
Watergate was one held for months while the WaPo knew, but had to quadruple check and
varify. I remember My Lai was silent for months as well. And, then there was The Pentagon
Papers and Plame...all known and all held. Now, the Sandy Berger story is more of a
political zinger that was recently slow.

Now that Rupert Murdock owns the Washington Times,
the New York Stock Exchange and the Wall Street Journal I'm not
sure how his politics will influence the press and the economic perception.

I believe the stock market and other investment markets are more influenced
by perception than the economy is, IMHO. The buying, selling and trading without
any real product or value created (besides capital) is speculation and that's often
driven by a word, or lack of one. Companies can be strong but if capital is drained
by ridiculous investments without collateral they can eventually be effected too.

It seems investors want to tell the fed what to do now, rather than the fed
moderating the system. The rush to debt created by tax cuts, war costs,
outsourcing and ridiculously greedy mortgage brokers (selling off bad paper
through SIVs and big banks licking them up) have combined for a perfect financial
storm...again IMO.

However, I'm talking it here and with my wife only because I don't seek to reduce
the value or accessibility of my dollars. I have not taken my savings out for instance.
But, I have moved the small investments I have into secure notes and bonds and
have been working hard to scour my credit rating clean.

As one of the above items (the one from the Wall St. Journal) points out, perception
is certainly important - especially now in the "panic phase". But I'm not convinced
it...rather than sub prime mortgages and massive credit card debt got us here.

Most of my current opinion is formed through having an interest in reading what experts
on all sides are writing. But, I do remember "Guns or Butter". Since my degrees were
in newspaper and photo journalism, I certainly am no expert in economics.
I enjoy all the information better-schooled folks have to offer...
so... where do you see the market and the economy by say July?
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